Very well said, my friend. I sat here nodding my head in agreement.

I try so very much to avoid the whole ‘I agree’ comment. But you know what, I cannot avoid it this time. I whole-heartedly agree.

And - if you’ll permit me to open up a little - my confidence in blogging took a major boost when I received that email from Tyme, but since then it appears others have just wanted to damage that. I must commend Glenn at this point, because he has dealt with some particular comments admirably, and I know that when I was his age I wouldn’t have been so understanding and diplomatic. Maybe it is just that which marks some people out as deserving of accolades (be they private or public) than others.

And as for your penultimate paragraph, Tam: Allow me to quote my boss, “What is worst thing someone can say to you? Yes!” Let it be known that I am crapping myself because they said ‘Yes’, but similtaneously enjoying the challenge!

A great post, and words well spoken.

I know it sounds crass, but I suspect it was all a ruse to generate hype for the upcoming re-design. Any publicity is good publicity and this ‘note’ seems to have people talking.

@James : My aren’t we a cynical bunny. I don’t believe that myself otherwise I would be part of the network and even writing about it on my blog. That age old cry of publicity is good in all senses I don’t 100% agree with myself.

I may be accused from living in a fluffy idealised world but I won’t ever subscribe to the theory you do on this one. I don’t think 9rules respect their members so little to do such a thing as a publicity stunt and call out one they have just accepted in it - if I ever found out they did I would have to consider my own membership to 9rules.

@Ryan and Ollie : Glad others feel the same.

I totally agree one of the worst things is to say yes. I agree at Glenn’s age I wouldn’t have dealt with that as well as he did - kudos to him big time as far as I can see. I think kudos to the team at 9rules also for taking the comment and continuing the discussion.

Well said.

Yeah, we routinely start overly negative things about us just to drum up publicity. Trust me, when we drop our new stuff, we won’t need to publicize it.

Scrivs dancing is bad publicity. I’m certain this note was legit.

Christian: You are not even ready for the new dance video son!

James I don’t believe any publicity is good publicity and honestly I don’t understand the logic. I’m trying, but I don’t get it.

Why would we purposely insult our Round 5 members? And pick Glenn, the youngest member (a minor) to do it? That would be cruel. Insensitive. Manipulative. Inconsiderate. To me, it’s unthinkable.

Honestly, we’re too focused on the hot new stuff to care about hype. Hype comes naturally for us, we don’t have to create it.

I don’t think the world is prepared if the new stuff and a new video come out at the same time, I know I would probably pass out if that happened :)

As I’ve said before I think not only me but a whole lot of 9rulers would be bailing if James you were right. Thanks for responding Scrivs, Mike and Tyme - I think yet again you are proving cool headedness in the face of some pretty strong accusations.

@James : I thought a while about saying what I am about to say, but I think it needs saying. I get such great jumps of joy when new people join in on this blog and so please James don’t take this offensive - take it as a call to continue the discussion. I could be cynical myself and think you just joined this conversation to say such a thing for your own personal against 9rules reasons - please prove me wrong and let me go back into my fluffy world :) I’d love to be wrong on that one, so please join in and tell me what if not just that note / things that have been said you are basing your comment on - you seem to be basing it on past events as you see them not just this one.

[…] 9rules is starting to lose much of it’s quality. I am not bitter that I was not accepted in the 5th round. In fact, I was kind of afraid of saying something considering that it might hurt my chances of acceptance in round 6. But fortunately, another 9rules member has stated that they feel their quality slipping as well. But I think some of the new sites (such as Karoshi) deserve to be in 9rules and I feel their addition is a boon to the network. […]

This is ultimately the problem with the ‘anonymousness’ of blogging and commenting ;). While some are quite open about their identity and their intentions, others are not. Nobody will ever know the ‘truth’ for certain and we are all left taking the word of three entrepreneurs.

I agree that 9rules has certainly evolved, having gone from a p/t hobby to a f/t job for its three founders. With this transition comes new requirements and obligations as it must now support salaries and, if they have investors, turn a profit. The tight integration to ‘Scrivs and Tyme’ and ‘Business Logs’ on each page, i.e. putting this content ahead of all others, suggests that there are now real business decisions being made at 9rules with respect to generating revenue. Note, the ‘1.5 black people can’t be wrong’ is an great copy line for their market. My original point was that this hype about ‘quality’ and the new design (one that is so good ‘we don’t need to publicize it’) may be further examples of how things are changing at 9rules. The original note may or may not have originated at 9rules (there will never be proof either way) but 9rules is publicly responding and they are spinning it to get their own message out. They may also be perpetuating the discussion somewhat:

@Mike: “we’re listening to this thread.”

@Tyme: “There is a little bet going on amongst readers [members?] how many more people are going to create a profile to respond in this discussion”

As a casual observer, I agree that it does seem rather conveniently timed between the 5th round and the release of a new site design. More importantly, it does have people talking about 9rules again. Take a look at the Technorati stats for the last week and compare with the previous two.

Ultimately, I suspect that 9rules will become increasingly about the brand and not the content. This is why it is important that the network grow and diversify. The quality needs to stay high-enough, but it is currently only a secondary concern because you can always quietly drop a few of the low-tier performers later. Likewise, the ‘community’ aspect draws new bloggers into an exclusive club. It needs to be large enough to expose many to the brand, but not so large that everyone can be part of it. In the past, a 9rules logo was akin to driving around the mall in a Porsche. I suspect they are aiming to have the exclusivity associated with walking around the mall in an oversized ‘Club Monaco’ or ‘Gap’ sweatshirt (the ones with the large logo on the front). In the new 9rules it is the brand and the 9rules logo on each member site that is marketable and will ultimately generate revenue for investors.

@Mike wrote: “Trust me, when we drop our new stuff, we won’t need to publicize it.”

@Tyme wrote: “Hype comes naturally for us, we don’t have to create it.”

I caution that you can go too far in trying to convey a cool image to the public; if you are too brash, you can come across as arrogant. Nevertheless, the take-home message above clearly emphasizes the goal of establishing a cool brand. These are cool people and everyone writing a blog should want to be associated with them. Welcome to the age of persuasion, 9rules style.

Before I respond to the latest comments I would just like to make one thing clear. I have seen a post quoting this post as a ‘9rules member has stated that they feel their quality is slipping too’. I am not going to remove the ping back as I have asked them to correct their post - it’s also a great example of how someone can take something and twist it. I am still at lost to see where this assumption was made that I said that the quality was slipping in 9rules.

I would just like to clarify my feelings on this. Firstly I am not even saying that and I do not feel that at all - if my post is read it will be seen I couldn’t disagree more with that statment (the entire post is against that at the core along with a lot of other points). I am a bit grumpy about being even associated as saying that and have contacted the blog regarding this. If anyone else was under the notion I was saying 9rules quality is slipping, let me put that straight right now in saying I do not feel that way.

My argument was aimed at if you do feel it is maybe you should interact with the blogger - give them time to settle. I firmly believe every single blog that got into 9rules deserves to get into it and should yes see it as a pat on the back, but they should also never rest on laurels (perhaps this is where I am being misquoted). I have seen decisions made by 9rules to remove people but that is up to them. All current members have the right to be in 9rules otherwise they wouldn’t be there. I think the quality is added to everytime a new blog comes not taken away - this is my view on it.

@James : Thanks so much for responding and it’s great to see you coming back to the conversation. You’ve put faith back in my world and stepped up with a well thought out reply. I still disagree about the spinning but it’s your opinion. I just feel it’s a valid response to something that was put on the site. Just like I am defending my own position by being misquoted - they were stating their position.

I still differ on the notion that the quality of anything 9rules is slipping. I also actually like the model I see that is being applied to 9rules. The community aspect that they are going for strikes out as different from any other blog network. I never wanted to join a blog network until 9rules. One of the reasons being it’s not just a ‘link farm’ and it’s not forcing my to change my identity or anything about my blog. Infact I am encouraged to speak as I would and never asked to blog about anything to do with the network.

As a member I don’t feel the content is secondary and that is from my perspective what I care about along with if it works for me as a member. I would say everyone has their own perspectives and sees it differently (that is clear). As a member 9rules works for me and the ability to install such passion in me and others is something that many other networks should look at. You can see from here and my reaction to being misquoted how the passion of 9rules has reached my core - something I never felt a blog network would do. I spent a long time avoiding joining any form of network. You will find a lot of people in 9rules that you would never see in another network - many have turned down other networks despite being asked.

I did laugh about your gap statement - over in the UK gap is so not something to be prized now. I guess maybe in the US it’s different and for some over here it is too - for me I am not a brand junkie. I use Apple becuase it does the job best for me, I wear the clothes I do because I like them and they work for me. I think it’s been a long time since I brought something just because it had a label on it. I drive a Vauxhall estate so hardly went for that for the ‘in crowd’ factor - it was a ‘can it fit a trip to ikea in it’ and ‘can i get 2 dogs in the back’ decision.

Creating a brand is important but being inside 9rules this isn’t something that I care about so much really. I do see it may be something that can be seen but I also think it results in having something worth using. The majority of hyped brands that for a reason - people see through just the hype and candyfloss content. People and audiences have gone a long way from just having something like sheep and it’s majority based on that as getting bums in - it’s something else to keep them there.

I should add, I’m an analyst/scientist (a paid skeptic) who was forced to take 2 solid weeks of ‘PR training’ when I started with my current employer. I must also attend 2 additional PR seminars each year as paid training. For me ’spin’ is nothing more than the ability to acknowledge a tough question/comment, deflect it slightly and get your message out. I lived in the UK for 4 years and the political/journalist spin and the association with political rhetoric is incredible (NB: I drove a L-reg pug diesel).

“I just feel it’s a valid response to something that was put on the site. Just like I am defending my own position by being misquoted - they were stating their position.”

The challenge is that PR is everywhere these days and, when done well, it is impossible to tell a PR line from an honest reply. Certainly at every company where I’ve worked, anyone speaking to journalists or the public is required to have taken some in-house PR training.

I agree that the whole debate about the quality of 9rules content isn’t well reasoned because the network and its growth are not about quality. I see 9rules as a simply a brand (aka ‘community’, aka ‘network’) where members feel cool by association.

“I did laugh about your gap statement - over in the UK gap is so not something to be prized now.”

The comment about the ‘Gap’ and ‘Club Monaco’ were actually chosen deliberately. Both are brands that try to associate themselves with ‘being cool’ and a member of an exclusive group. Alas, neither is particularly cool at the moment. Can you remember what made the Gap so un-cool in the UK? I don’t know the answer, but I think it may be related to the fact that they are now commodity goods available on the high street in every UK city. They are no longer coveted because they are no longer as exclusive. As a 9rules member, you are caught up in the community and are rallying to protect a brand which you like and associate with. That is a perfectly reasonable thing to do as you obviously have very strong feelings associated with the brand. From the outside, however, seeing the 9rules logo on a website is similar to seeing a branded t-shirt on the high street. Some walk by and think, ‘I need one of those’ while others walk by and wonder why it is cool to be a walking billboard?

This turned out to be a reasonable discussion.

James: Being a skeptic I could see how you would think that we would have some motivation behind creating such a Note and in all honesty if 9rules was just Mike, Tyme and myself then maybe that would be a strategy to take. However, fortunately for us we are blessed to have 300+ sites that make 9rules what it is today and what we do not only reflects on us, but on them as well. Admittedly there are times where we think “man having a million dollars right now” would be awesome and sellout, but we haven’t and we don’t plan on it because we have a responsibility to a group of people to put the best site out there that we can. That’s what we are working on now.

Being that our communication is in online text form, we can construe whatever tone we wish from these words so when Mike and Tyme speak there might be a little cockiness behind it (which every company needs), but there is even more enthusiasm behind it. We are genuinely excited, proud and passionate about the new site and we are trying our best to keep things tight-lipped because we want the site to speak for itself.

All we are witnessing now is how people handle change. Some people will like it and others will hate it. I will say though that when the new site comes out there will be a whole new type of discussion revolving around the positive and negative aspects of it.

With regards to brand, yes we value ours. We also know that our brand wouldn’t exist without the Community that has created it. You may not equate the 9rules brand with quality, but I know there are others out there that do. If our brand evokes emotions in people, then we have done something that probably 99% of the other web companies out today haven’t done and created something that goes beyond the screen. What we do with that potential is still left to be seen and we could either flourish or flounder (which we don’t plan on).

And although I do wish that everyone loved 9rules and threw nothing but praise upon us I know this isn’t the reality of things. Would I trade places with other companies that don’t have these conversations out in the open with people who wish to judge one way or another where our quality is going? No way in hell. Most companies, especially in our field, don’t get any feedback one way or another because people could care less with what they do.

If Technorati stats were what we are looking at we would hold a contest and ask all our Members to promote it. I’m not an expert at PR, but I do know a thing or two about getting attention.

@Scrivs : I agree it is turning into a reasonable discussion. Also, it’s providing me with a future post on ‘how things online can get twisted by someone’ (puts soapbox down).

@James : Explaining your background does put a lot of things you say in context. I have no such background, I also agree that being in it may be tainting my objectivity in some eyes. Ah, I understand the Gap comment now also and see where you were going with it. I don’t think it applies to 9rules but then again I think maybe this is as you say the apples and oranges comparism.

I really think 9rules is starting to need a whole new word or label - I also think blog network doesn’t sum it. In my mind it sort of is what one should be, but in the general place it’s not a label that fits against others. I still don’t ride with the 9rules is cool philosophy, however I can see how some may see that and your view is put across well. Maybe I am just using my own judgement on it, but to me it’s not cool it’s (trying to think of a better word) logical in the sense of what a network should be and should do. Possibly it’s just the semantic nature and what I associate the word ‘cool’ as being makes me not want to use it. Keep getting flashes of chavs in clubs making 9rules signs bigging up the 9rules posse or something…

@Scrivs : From the inside it’s very obvious that care is being taken to consider the sites in 9rules. I think that is one thing that makes us so passionate about 9rules. I do see the point of ‘being talked about’ - it’s a bit of a balancing act with positive and negative emotions. I do agree though that it’s a pretty unique situation where 9rules has both sides and in such large chunks, along with the people at the helm being so open and engaging in responses.

I still think the brand and the ‘emotive’ quality of 9rules is a core thing that many should be looking at. Over in England there is a product called Marmite and this sort of reminded me of it (bare with me on this one). Their marketing campaign is ‘love it or hate it’. It’s basically a spread that people tend to have very strong emotions over (yes we are odd about our food over here) and literally the ‘love it or hate it’ about sums up people’s reactions. They’ve built this whole marketing campaign up on just that. Can we call the next 9rules the ‘Marmite version?’, maybe a tag line of ‘love us or hate us, you’re talking about us’.

I am sorry that I misquoted you. I assure you that there was no malicious intent to twist what you said. I am not going to delete anything from the post, but I will edit it to include an annotation at the bottom. My most sincere apologies.

@Kyle : Thanks for responding to my request, no hard feelings at all. Be interested in fact to know where you felt I was saying that out of interest - always interested to see where mis-interpretations can occur.